randomWalks

Convicted Killer Seeks Clemency Hearing (LA Times) Registration required. login/password combo: bselig/bselig.

Here is another outrageous California case, involving, of all things, a lying jailhouse informant named Fink.

I lived in Chino, Ca. when this man you are trying to save MURDERED an entire family. He gave false information to the prison system and was placed in min. security. He later escaped and hid in a corn field until dark. He then walked up a hilside where this INNOCENT family was sleeping in their beds. He broke in and killed all but one child, which by the way, was the same age as my son, with the same name;Joshua. He cut the boys neck and when Kevin was not looking, the boy crawled into the bath tub and nearly bled to death. He witnessed the entire ordeal...So, now this 23 yr. old man, whom last I heard cannot speak, gets to re-live this entire ordeal, through the media, and all the old bottled up feelings will be back to haunt him...How would all you "heroes" like it if something like this happend to your family?? Why don't you ask Joshua....

I don't know if you're going to bother to come back, but what's a worse possibility--the fact that these crimes committed or the fact that this occurred AND the wrong man is going to die for it AND the person or people that did it are still free?

In this case there are huge amounts of evidence that were ignored or tampered with that point to Cooper's innocence--most telling was a clump of BLOND HAIR in the hands of one of the victims. That didn't come from any of the other victims, nor did it come from Cooper. Moreover, someone else confessed. Take five minutes to look at the site linked above.

There have been more than 100 innocent people freed from Death Row. What makes you so sure that Cooper's not another?

I too lived in Chino when this happened.

The so called "famous people" who support

this crazed killer need to learn a little

more facts in this case.

Kevin's DNA was found on the hachet clothing

the cigarette butts in their stolen car.

These supporters think they are intellects

to be listened too?

What a joke! What fools they make out of themselves!

The Governor has spoken. He will die a

peaceful death.

If he truly had found God, he would of confessed.

If anybody deserves to be executed it is Kevin Cooper. He is a evil person and does not deserve a second chance. He did not give my nephew a second change when he killed him. I wonder if you people would feel the same way if it was your family that he killed.

This crime was committed by a crew, not an individual, and if you really are related to the victim or live anywhere near Chino you should be angry and frightened that they are still at large.

Zagg’s right. Read the link. A girl gave a pair of bloody coveralls to the cops and said her boyfriend was involved in the murders. The cops threw the coveralls in a dumpster. She bought her boyfriend a brown t-shirt that matches one found at the crime scene, but she didn’t testify. A friend of hers even confessed involvement, telling his cellmate things that weren’t publicly known about the murders.

This evidence was not heard at trial. How can this be fair? How can you be so sure you’re right? How can minions of the same bureaucracy that runs the DMV and Franchise Tax Board accurately decide who should be put to death?

I hear it's a racist thing.. The Forensics

were botched......Just Like OJ's

RW Stewart

i think it time to tell kevin copper " hasta la vista "

...Blond hair, bloody overalls,dumpsters...None of that explains how HIS DNA was found at the crime scene. I know what your next comment will be: "It was planted" and "it's all been contaminated". For those of you who think you know the facts by reading various web sites, of which, most were penned by Kevin Cooper,himself. You should have been in the city all the while this was taking place first hand...Most of what has been said is fairly recent. Kevin and his "team" have had a few years to come up with so many "theories" as to what could have happen. Bottom line, they have their man, and his lack of inteligence or his skin color has absolutly to do with any of this. I think it's time you all need stop using race as a reason why it's impossible for any man or woman not to have commited a crime.....For those who are interested is saving lives...There are MANY ways to do so...There are hundreds of innocent lives that are distroyed each day, most of the time because: "it's inconvient" and "bad timing"...Why aren't you spending your time creating sites and posting messages to further PRO LIFE causes????? Those are the lives that are truly INNOCENT!!

To all the familes involved in this case, I pray that GOD gives you all grace and the peace you will need to get through this...May our are Lord bless and be with you now and always...

You should have been in the city all the while this was taking place first hand

Yes, the lovely city of Chino circa 1983, where a toy gorilla is hung in effigy by a racist crowd at the guy's trial.

Here's Indymedia on the DNA issue: "Cooper won the right to a DNA test after a three-year fight. The blood tested was determined to be his. But Cooper and his lawyers were unaware that a portion of the evidence had been removed for 24 hours by a criminologist who admitted to changing test results."

Also: "Joshua Ryen, the sole witness to his family's murder, told police there were three killers and that they were all white or Latino men."

No one's saying "Free Kevin Cooper" at this point, or at least I'm not. We're saying, let's stop the death machine for just a moment and take another look.

For all you people that think Mr. Cooper should have his life saved you were not there you did not see what he has done to my family. He had a fair trail and all the DNA testing has Mr. Cooper's name all over it. As far as the jury not hearing all the evidence the transcripts from the trial are open to the public to read. Maybe you should read them before you say anything. You were not at the trial. I wonder if you would so willing if it was your family.

Jane, Over the years I have often thought of your family, how is Joshua doing? Tell him my family and I are praying for all of you! At this point, it must be very hard for you. I know there can never be justice in another "murder", but this is the "law of the land" and we must all be law abiding otherwise people who stand on the fence between good and evil may not think twice when they take it upon themselves to take someones life. We have "free will", it's up to us to choose the direction we will go. Our God is a just God. There is freedom in knowing that if Kevin is "saved", as he says he is, then on the day of his "judgement" he will have an opportunity to answer for his entire life and be assured of his eternity...God bless you all!

He had a fair trail ...

In your opinion.

all the DNA testing has Mr. Cooper's name all over it.

And the charges that the DNA testing was tampered doesn't bother you in the least?

What about the other confession? It doesn't put any doubt in you at all that someone else has confessed to the crime?

I wonder if you would so willing if it was your family.

I've been on the flip side. I've worked with dozens of people that were wrongly convicted that have since been exonerated. There have been more than 110 people convicted and put on death row--some even that had execution dates--that were eventually found innocent.

But there were others who we think were innocent that were executed. That feels pretty horrible too--knowing that someone who is innocent is being put to death by a state that doesn't care. And knowing that they'd rather kill the wrong man than make sure the justice system is working. They'd rather put innocent men to death than admit that the system might not be working. And they'll do whatever it takes--including lie and tamper with evidence--to make the system seem infallible.

I attended school with Christopher Hughes, one of Kevin Cooper's victims. I was 12 when the crime was committed. I am now 33 years old. The time for Kevin Cooper to pay for his crime has come.

1. The "blond hairs" found glued to the victims hands with their blood belong to the dozens of animals they owned. They lived on a horse ranch. Animal hair was all over the house.

2. Mr. cooper was initially identified as the suspect based on the fact he CALLED HIS GIRLFRIEND from the vacant house next door to the Ryen's, where the murder weapons and bloody clothes were later discovered. You're telling me that a desperate escaped convict (who previously escaped from a mental hospital for the criminally insane in pennsylvania where he raped and tried to stab to death a young girl) found the only vacant house in the area, broke in, called his girlfriend who refused to come get him, then, being the kind hearted sole that he is, simply WALKED 100 miles TO TIJUANA. Then, 5 minutes after he started his walk, ANOTHER person found the same abandoned house (which lies over a mile away from any public road), collected the weapons that would be used in the crime, and killed 4 people? What planet do you live on? Kevin Cooper NEEDED a getaway car. For that old beat up green panel station wagon, he MURDERED the ocupants of that house while they slept.

3. There was no opportunity for the police to "plant the evidence" because Mr. Cooper was a fugitive for 3 months after the crime was committed. The police did not HAVE his blood to plant at the scene until 3 months after it was discovered. He was then arrested... for raping the woman who had taken him in.

And ANOTHER THING!

1. As far as the "others confessing" argument. In EVERY high profile crime, (and this was the BIGGEST, MOST NOTORIOUS crime in the LARGEST COUNTY IN AMERICA) DOZENS of nutcases climb out of the woodwork to confess to the crime. If "other people confessed" was the test we used to not incarcerate people, WE COULD NEVER punish ANYBODY. Many confess because they are seriously mentally ill, and crave the fame that goes along with such a crime. Likewise, prisoners are NOTORIOUS for confessing to their cellmates to violent crimes they weren't involved in, because in prison, people who have killed have a special status among the rest of their social set. And be honest... When the next death penalty case comes up where the defendant confessed to the crime, the same people who are now arguing that "we HAVE to listen to the confessions" of these nutcases are going to drag out the "false confession" arguments to prove that confessions are worthless.

2. As far as race being an issue, if you had any clue about the heinous nature of this crime, you would understand race has nothing to do with it. Everybody who knew how these people were butchered knew what the only just penalty could be, before the race of the killer was even known. Whether the killer was white, black, brown or green, doesn't matter. The only color that matters in this case is the RED of the victims blood that was drained all over that house. It just so happens the person who did it is black, which gives his supporters just another falacious argument to throw against the wall to see if it sticks. If there is going to be a death penalty in this country, (and that is a question for another debate. The penalty was in effect when the crime was committed and is in effect 20 years later because a majority of the populice wants it) then this is the crime it was designed for. What can be more deserving of the ultimate punishment than the hatchet murder of children?

3. As far as the "bloody coveralls" and "Brown shirt" argument. A woman, who admits to abusing crystal meth around the time of the crime; who lived 50 miles from the crime; who, by the way, met her boyfriend who was incarcerated for killing someone else while visiting her previous boyfriend in prison, (read: "NUTCASE") says: her "Hells Angles" boyfriend came home from a biker bar on the same Saturday night of the murders with blood on his coveralls. How many "Hells Angeles" come home on any given Saturday night with bloody clothes simply because their lifestyle is one of frequent drunken brawls? Oh but wait... she bought him a BROWN SHIRT!!! Stop the Presses! I wonder how many MILLIONS of BROWN shirts there are in the country. And lets not forget the kicker- It was revealed to her, that her boyfriend committed the murder while she was doing a SEANCE with her other witch friends....

The fact that THIS unrelated garbage is EVIDENCE to you people of Cooper's innocence, but the FACT that KEVIN COOPER admits to hiding in the same house the killer used to clean up after the crime is just a 'wild coincidence', proves your real agenda. YOU DON'T CARE that he killed them. Your idealogical disagreement with the punishment is such that you would beleive anything he said if it furthered your cause.

We're generally opposed to the death penalty around here, son. And your spelling is terrible.

The fact that you were 12 when the murders were committed hardly gives you special insight on this case or the appropriateness of the death penalty. Just the opposite.

I've been a lawyer in the State of California for 20 years. The sad fact of life is that our cops lie, plant evidence, and fuck up left and right. This was a particularly sloppy, dubious prosecution even by California standards. There is clear doubt about the man's guilt, and it would be a disgrace if he is executed.

First off , I have to disagree with xowie that, " It would be a disgrace if he is executed!" No offense, but what the hell do you even know about this case, do you even live around here, do you know anything about this case? We all lived around here and we want to see some justice. Maybe California should start thinking a little more about the death penalty, then assholes like him wouldn't be free. To me, he already murdered before, stolen ,raped, then on top of all this he's convicted of murdering the Ryen family. People try to say that he had nothing to do with this murder that he didnt kill the family, but he was still there that night, and isnt that just as bad that he helped out? I think everyone that lives here in my area want peace now in their lives, and they should have it, Kevin Cooper must die!!!!

Well, my dad worked for the Beet Sugar company (the biggest employer in Chino Hills) when I was growing up, and I myself have lived in Southern California for 20 years. I have been hearing about the Ryen family murders just about as long as I've been here.

It is a fact that many residents of Chino disgraced themselves and their community twenty years ago holding "Hang the Nigger" signs at a public trial. The comments you all have left here don't seem too far removed from the lynch mob mentality, sadly.

Also, keep in mind that you are guests here. Attacks on our editors, besides being rude, betray the ignorance and vulgarity of your own position (and will of course be deleted).

I was one of the first Deputies to respond to the Ryen House on Old English Road at Approx.1045 on Sunday June 4 1983. I can tell you that the images of death that were personally witnessed that day can be brought back at a given moment. My heart goes out to the Hughes family and the Ryen family.I remember making contact with Mr. Hughes at the crime scene.As a parent of a 12 year old boy I can not imagine how he must have felt that morning.I have read all of the garbage listed above that disputes the guilt of Kevin Cooper.The fact is,he is a cold blooded killer that was convicted by evidence beyond a reasonable doubt.He will and should be put to death at12:01 on 2-10-04.Do not believe the "smoke" that Coopers advocates have thrown out there.The world is about to become a better place.

Dear rh, thank you for your comment.

In all your experience as a Sheriff's Deputy have you ever seen (or even heard about) a quadruple murder committed by one person with three different weapons? Why would one man use a hatchet, knife and icepick when only a hatchet or knife would do?

I'm sure it was an unbelievable crime scene, but on your first observation, did you think it likely there was a single perpetrator, or multiple perpetrators? Did you think it likely that the perpetrator(s) were amped on meth or PCP, or was your impression that this was the work of a sober individual?

Was the Sheriff’s Department and Police Department sincerely interested in pursuing multiple leads to solve the case? Was any real attention paid to the biker gang theory? What would have been the reaction if someone wanted to spend Department resources on pursuing that lead?

What was the reputation of the Sheriff’s Department and P.D. at the time? Were there any racist cops there? ACLU or CHIRLA complaints? Undocumented workers, stopped at random on the street, things like that? (You know this stuff is on record.)

Did you testify at the trial? Did you personally observe anything that led you to believe in Kevin Cooper's guilt and sole responsibility?

Eric, It's nice to see that someone knows what is really going on. I'm Christophers aunt we would like to talk with you. We still live in the same house and go to the same church. Could we connect at church?

Jane

shame on you!

They were my friends. I went to school with them.

Joshua was a very scared little boy 21 years ago. He has lived the last 21 years with the memories of that night, when his big sister, his friend two houses over and his parent were brutally murdered. Here, to many of you comment that it's black history month, how can we allow this? Where the hell were you 21 years ago when Joshua got his throat cut and lives with seeing those scares daily? I don't remember you being there for this little boy. I remember sitting with my mother crying when we found out, I was never allowed to see him again, I was never allowed to tell him how sorry i was. I hope, I pray that Justice is done and that Josh can finally put this bad horify memory behind him. Kevin Cooper didn't desirve to live the past 21 years with three free meals a day, t.v., a weight room, and rehabilitation. Who took care of those things for Josh, not you, not the state. Shame on you all who think that kevin cooper has a right to continue to live off my tax paying dime.

The L.A. Archdiocese has a nice page of resources on the flaws of this case, e.g.:

• During a police interview, Ms. Roper told police that Furrows was wearing a beige t-shirt the night of the murders.

• The police found a beige, bloodstained t-shirt approximately 1/2 mile from the crime scene, which t-shirt was determined to have Doug Ryen’s blood on it.
• Patrons of the rural bar right next to where the shirt was found reported seeing three, unfamiliar, white men at the bar the night of the murders. The bartender testified that one of three men was wearing a beige t-shirt, similar to the one that was found to have Doug Ryen's blood on it.
• Ms. Roper also told police that Furrows owned a hatchet that was missing from his tool belt after the murders.
• Consistent with Josh Ryen’s statements made immediately after the crime, eyewitnesses saw three or four people speeding away from the Ryen Family house in the family’s car, shortly after the murders were committed.
• A convicted felon, Kenneth Koon, confessed to his cellmate, Anthony Wisely, that he was involved with two other men in the Ryen Family murders. Koon and Furrows know each other. According to the cellmate, on the day of the murders, Furrows bailed an individual named Michael Darnell, out of jail. Furrows, Darnell, and Koon are three white men, all of whom share a criminal history, including one being convicted of a grisly murder. Koon told his cellmate that the Ryen murders were an Aryan Brotherhood ‘hit’ gone wrong.
• Jurors never heard evidence of the Koon confession or Diana Roper’s statements.

Also via the Archdiocese page: A Comparison of the Illinois Commission Report on Capital Punishment to the Capital Punishment System of California, which concludes:

"The conclusion of the study is that California’s system is seriously flawed and dangerously unjust. There is no assurance that the people on California’s death row, the largest death row population of any state in the United States, have been selected fairly or with any assurance of accuracy."

Shame on thee, California!

Jane:

I tried to send you an email, but the address was denied. Id very much like to speak with you, but I no longer live near Claremont. Send me an email.

Thanks!

Xowie

Yes, I did testify at the trial,which was in fact moved to San Diego( just in case you may question my knowlegdge of the case)I take exeption to your comments about the law enforcement profession, I need not get into a lawyer ehics debate.

I have been in this profession long enough to know that we do have "bad Cops", we find them,fire them, prosecute them and get back to work upholding the laws in which we are paid to enforce.

I also understand your passion for the cause against the death penalty.My faith (based on your references above) is the same as yours.(Please do not comment on how ashamed I should be to support the death penalty,that is not what this is about).

I have personnally witnessed hundreds of VICTIMS whose lives were taken by the likes of the Kevin Coopers of the world.

Everyone has a right to voice thier opinion.I respect yours,I disagree with it in this case, but I still respect it!That is what makes America so great.

I am not some closed minded "Cop" that you have whitewashed in your comments from above.I am well educated,well read,and open to change my opinions if presented with enough evidence.

I understand that the death penalty opponents are currently making the Kevin Cooper case thier cause for the moment.Good for them.

I did in fact in the beginning question how one man could do this to a family and neighbor.After reviewing all of the evidence and walking through the crime scene (in my mind) I quickly came to the conclusion that one man did do this,his name is Kevin Cooper.

I do not look forward to seeing Mr.Hughes "late" Monday eve. I am sure that I will shed a tear or two on his behalf,and for the four souls that are no longer here to enjoy life.

So much is written about the suspect and not enough about the VICTIMS. I do however look forward to bringing an end to one of the most horrific crimes in the history of San Bernardino County.

If my opinion on the death penalty changes upon my return to the Southland on Tues.afternoon, I am open minded enough to let you know.

Thanks. I hope the execution is put off and you won’t have to go, because you’re a Christian man and it won’t be easy for you, regardless of what you may think now.

Most cops would say it's impossible for a single assailant to attack five people by hand and kill four of them, including an ex-Marine, without being completely whacked out on PCP or meth. Your own eyes told you this was not the work of one man. You had to be socialized into believing it, by reading evidence others had collected and interpreted.

By the way, don’t think for a minute that Orrick, Herrington & Sutcliffe would be involved if this case had no merit. Orrick is one of the most prestigious law firms in California; their work in the bond underwriting area makes it possible for most police departments and other city agencies in California to stay in business. They took on the case because there is substantial evidence of Kevin Cooper’s innocence.

Xowie:

I owe you an apology.

This site has done more to organize and vulcanize support for the execution of Kevin Cooper than anything in the last twenty years.

You do owe me an apology. You were quite rude last night. Yet I allowed you connect with Jane because that was the Christian thing to do.

I'm responding to:

jeri at January 30, 2004 08:17 PM

I'm so sorry your nephew suffered and was killed. I am deeply sorry for your loss. I remain opposed to capital punishment and feel that it is precisely your response that motivate this writing and my determination to end capital punishment.

Many problems remain in our culture regarding death sentencing. IF I had lost a family member, my feelings would no doubt be conflicted and confused and very possibly vile and seeking reciprocation... an eye for an eye. However, as a civil society, it is my civic obligation to think rationally and not to succumb to these kinds of feelings associated with grieving and great personal loss - on behalf of you and innocent victims wrongly accused also.

HOW DO WE BEHAVE AS A culture, as a community, as a SOCIETY the world over on the matter of retribution - of imposing death sentencing?

We must act from another plane - from the fact that:

- we are not capable to judge others at this level of finality (imposing death), because we err too.

- we create conditions that promote horrorific actions and we must examine those also.

- those who must execute our desires as a culture to kill humans suffer with the remorse and contradictions thier actions bring in their own lives

Please read thoroughly about the history of death by the state.

Be well and thanks for reading.

Louise

Two new links, from Democracy Now! and Counterpunch

"My Innocence Keeps Me Strong" - Kevin Cooper Speaks From Death Row

and "This is not my execution and I will not claim it..

I find it so hard that there are people out there that try and protect these killers. It makes me sick. I remember this case like it was yesterday. I feel so bad for the families who have gone threw this whole ordeal. The pain and suffering that is still remembered daily. The thing that sticks out the most is how these supporters of Kevin Cooper claim that racism is involved. How about the fact that his victims were white? Why is this always the case. Its always the poor CONVICTED murderer that gets to play the race card. Why don't we start playing the race card that the fact his victims were white. Those poor kids, i can't imagine the look on there face while being sliced and stabbed to death by human garbage. How about the Witchita Massacre? The Carr brothers murderd all those white kids? Know why because hate crimes do happen against whites. Look at Zimbabwe, Mugabe ordered the murder of white farmers. I can't wait till Feb 10.

I find it so hard to believe that people posting here can be so sure when so many others have doubts, including members of the original jury:

Amassed in the arguments are statements from at least six jurors, including an alternate and the foreman, expressing their doubts because of controversy that has brewed since the investigation of the 1983 murders of a Chino Hills couple, their daughter and a young houseguest while they slept.

"Because the murders were so atrocious, and because of the devastating loss of life, at the time I let the police misconduct go and sentenced Mr. Cooper to death. I now regret that decision," one juror wrote.

Also it's not like Schwarzenegger simply denied clemency--he denied a clemency hearing. Cooper is the first person since California re-instituted the death penalty in 1978 to ever be denied a hearing.

I find it so hard that there are people out there that try and protect these killers.

It makes me sick.

Me too, Rusty. And that's why I don't want the state to commit murder in my name.

It is such a shame that this conversation is taking olace 20 years after the murders of a family. Mr Coopers defense team(s) have dreamed up every possible defense over the years bring one after the other to the courts for ajudication. All previous appeals have failed. When DNA evidence became accepted they sought a review useing it. Again the evidence pointed directly to Mr. Cooper. I would guess that if we wait another 20 years to bring justice in this case there would be another 20 differnet theories about how it could not have been Kevin Cooper. I hope your work on this case eases your conscience for charging the public millions for the work your firm does on behalf cities and counties. I wonder what it would take to convince you and your followers of a persons guilt? I remember the Robert Alton Harris case and all of the death penalt foes wanted that conviction overturned also. Oh, did I forget to mention that Robert Alton Harris killed to peopl and later confessed to doing it.

It doesn't sound like you have any understanding of what is going on or who you are talking to. Nobody here has any connection with the law firms involved in the case. I suggest you click on some of the links and do some reading. You clearly have a lot to learn.

For anybody interested, here is a link to a site that has posted the evidence used to convict Kevin Cooper. Keep in mind that this is before the DNA evidence proved he was there.

http://www.kfi640.com/kevincooper.html

I stand corrected, your refernce to the law firm as a means of shoring up your argument led me to believe that you were with that firm. As for reading about this issue I have lived and worked in the San Bernadino County area most of my life. I have read and talked with individuals who were present at the crime scene. I have been to the Ryen home and I am aware of the layout of the property.

I have also read a couple of Mr. Coopers writings were he alleges that he has come to peace with God. If he has accepted the Lord into his heart then he must also appoligize to his victims. No where did I read were he has said he is sorry.

Also for someone his defense attorney said was of limited mental capcity his writings are pretty good.

Here is another article which shows the ridiculous nature of Kevin Cooper's defense.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/chronicle/archive/2004/01/30/EDGCS4K72R1.DTL

That's not exactly a ton of evidence; even the Court acknowledges that it's all circumstantial, and the DNA test is under challenge.

Don't forget, the trial judge stated several times on the record that the evidence was badly mishandled by the police.

Here's yesterday's full-page New York Times ad in support of Kevin Cooper.

The DNA is "under challenge" only because his supporters didn't like the result. There isn't a shred of actual evidence that points to ANYBODY but Kevin Cooper. Not once ounce. The goal of these people is to stall, delay, twist and lie, until all the people who remember the truth are dead, and the only people left just know the lie. I am happy to see so many people who remember the truth.

Counter-culture icon Wavy Gravy, dressed as 'Insanity Claus,' is led away by California Highway Patrol officers yesterday as he and others at the gates of San Quentin State Prison protested the upcoming execution of convicted killer Kevin Cooper.

Bonus links:

Rally in Berkeley to halt execution of inmate

California killing: the case of Kevin Cooper by Mumia Abu-Jamal

'Hurricane' Carter asks the governor to delay execution

Who says times have changed? by Kevin Cooper

Comment for Erik,

Wow, just read the info. on the site you posted. Hopefully others will read it as well. I am at a loss for words...For anyone to say this guy was at the wrong place at the wrong time, they are right. Just wish he didn't have to kill a family while "in the wrong place"...

God's blessings to all of you, goodnight!

You people are too much! The next thing you'll be saying is Richard Ramirez was wrongly convicted too. I would rather my tax dollars be spent helping educate children so they have a future instead of spent on supporting daily life for people who choose to murder the innocent.

Richard Ramirez, heh! We must like murderers around here, right?

Executing Kevin Cooper will not save your tax dollars or help the schoolchildren. An average execution in California costs $2,087,926, vs. $1,448,935 for life imprisonment without possibility of parole.

Xowie:

Now be honest. The additional cost to the taxpayers to execute somebody like Kevin Cooper is a result of all the bogus lawsuits and appeals people like you (those who oppose the death penalty) file to prevent the execution, which the state has to defend.

There's a little circular logic there, and it borders on political extortion.

The additional cost to the taxpayers to execute somebody like Kevin Cooper is a result of all the bogus lawsuits and appeals people like you (those who oppose the death penalty) file to prevent the execution, which the state has to defend.

Cuz Lord knows the state is infallible, right? They've never convicted an innocent man before, right? Let's just get rid of that pesky appeals process. Then the state will never have to admit when it convicts the wrong person!

Of course, I at least am opposed to the death penalty in all circumstances--not just in cases where there are questions of innocence.

Xowie:

1. Proper jury instructions are an element of every criminal trial. It doesn't cost any more for that.

2. The dual nature of the trial is deminimus compared to the cost of the guilt phase of a murder trial.

3. In California, Capital crimes are automatically appealed. I have no problem with that. You and I both know however, that isn't the end. In the next 4 days, Cooper's attorneys will bring appeals based upon the consitutionality of the death penalty, a matter LONG established in appeal after appeal after appeal before the U.S. Supreme Court. Those appeals will fail. You know it, and I know it. But they will bring them, and they will march them up the judicial ladder until the U.S.S.C. screams "ENOUGH! DON'T COME BACK!" They will bring appeal's based on the "new evidence," evidence which has been available and vetted multiple times over the last 20 years and managed to convince NOBODY except those with a political objection to the penalty. They will argue his previous lawyers were incompetent. They will argue he is mentally impaired (despite the fact that people who support him always comment on how bright and articulate he is.) These appeals all come on top of the half dozen or so appeals he has already brought, which time and again have been DENIED. At some point, even you must say to yourself "I guess he is guilty???"

Xowie, the fact that you are convinced of his innocense is irrelevent, because given your anti-death penalty stance, YOU COULD NEVER GET ON A DEATH PENALTY JURY IN THE FIRST PLACE! You would be kicked for cause.

I beleive Kevin Cooper is the greatest master of escape since Harry Houdini. Since the time he was 7 (when he first got into trouble with the law) until he was incarcerated in 1983, he managed to escape from no less than 12, Juvenile detention centers, jails, and mental hospitals. Escaping from San Quentin's death row is a bit more difficult, and can't be accomplished without help. So what has he done for the last 20 years? He has recruited hundreds of accomplices who are trying to aid his 13th escape from justice.

Zagg:

Nope, the state is fallable, it can make a mistake, that is why there is an automatic appeal. And with the advent of DNA testing, mistakes have become less of an issue. I have no problem with either. My problem is with when the results don't go your way, you appeal again, and again, and again, in a process that amounts to forum shopping. If you can just get the winning lottery ticket of an anti-death penalty justice, who is as blind to the evidence as you are, then the whole process starts AGAIN.

Kevin Cooper is INNOCENT! (PERIOD)

all you people who think different go to this website OK!

http://icujp.org/pdf/02.10.04_deathPenalty.pdf

NOW try to prove me wrong!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Nothing new on that site. Just the same old claptrap by the anti capital punishment gang that we've heard for the last 20 years.

Also, you have the burden of proof backwards. He has already been found GUILTY beyond a reasonable doubt. You have to PROVE there was some mistake in that trial, and every piece of evidence brought forward to this point either further proves he is GUILTY or is unverifiable conjecture.

Martha why don't you read the court documents from the trial it's open to the public. You people need to get your facts right. Cooper is guilty and is going to go to hell. They have the right man. Did you sit in court everyday and hear and see what went on I don't think so.

Nice job, Martha! There's more information about why Kevin Cooper should be saved over at the MetaFilter thread.

Mumia speaks.

Also, just a reminder that while I'm happy to keep debating with those that disagree, those who support Cooper should still be calling and e-mailing Schwarzenegger.

Lanny Davis, Rubin 'Hurricane' Carter and Kevin Cooper on today's Democracy Now.

Whoops. I missed that Xowie had already posted that Mumia link.

Also, just a reminder those who SUPPORT THE DEATH PENALTY for Cooper should also still be calling and e-mailing Schwarzenegger.

And by an NBC news poll 70% favor his execution, while 23% oppose (the rest are undecided.)

Funny, an Internet poll at the SF Chronicle shows that 70 percent support commuting his sentence to life.

Zagg

With all due respect, consider the source. I think we can both agree that San Francisco is by far the most left leaning city in the State, if not the country. If subscribers to the chronicle were a representation of the state as a whole, you would be e-mailing Governor Davis....

OH! I agree!!! don't give him an injection! give him what he gave that family!!

Gosh, that's witty. Strong opposition to execution -- And it's not just death-penalty foes.

Howard Stern? yea right,nice attempt to try and get everyone fired up.This is not a race issue!!

This is an issue of a convicted cold blooded killer that has been extended every possible legal remedy.There is nothing new to read about,or write about on the Kevin Cooper case.

Why is it that the likes of Xowie,Zagg and others NEVER write about the victims, or the surviving family members ??Lets seperate this case from the others rather than lump it together with all of the others cases that have CONVICTED KILLERS on death row.

I look at the photos of the young people that have posed with Kevin Cooper on some of the web site photos and feel very sorry for them.If any of them were to actually see any of the photos of the crime scene their skin would crawl.Sometimes youth truly is ignorant.

Yes Kevin Cooper now looks somewhat harmless,he has aged, and has written some interesting articles.Time does not change what he did on the morning of June 4th 1983.HE KILLED FOUR PEOPLE.

If you can place some of your convictions against the death penalty aside and really study the case with an open mind you would have to come to the conclusion that he was the killer.

To believe otherwise would lead me to think that some of you have been watching to many movies where the wrong guy gets framed.

The State does have the right guy and on Tues.2-10-2004 at 12;01HRS Mr. Kevin Cooper's debt to society comes due.End of story,end of all this bs about race,end of all of these misinformed messages on this web site.....

On another note,Xowie,you seem like a pretty smart person but your comments about bond underwriting is wrong as it relates to financing local law enforcement.

Local law enforcement is financed by the General funds of munincipalities,as in sales tax,property tax and assesement varies fees. Bond underwriting is usually used for capital improvments and deferment of large short term debt...

well i dont know much about the case but from what ive read i think hes guilty. It makes me sick that these people are crying racism isnt it racist to say that they where either white or mexican.they say that three unfamiliar whites who happened to be hells angels where seen a nearby bar they also say the little boy saw 3 mexicans looking for work some say he actually said it was 3 mexicans that did it. make up your minds where they 3 white bikers or 3 mexican day laborers.

oh i got a story for you fools maybe those 3 day laborers where actually members of the mexican mafia and the whites where with the aryan brotherhood maybe they paid the mexican men to do

their job. this makes as much sense as thinking someone will confuse 3 mexican day laborers to 3

white bikers with blond hairs. come on people kevin cooper is a monster who deserves to die

he destroyed a family its time this coward becomes

a man and accepts responsobilty for his action and stop blaming others

After reading a few comments I still have the same conclusion. There seems to be a preponderance of evident to suggest that this man was set-up. I myself have never agreed with the death penalty anyway as I feel no man has the right to take another’s life. But also I must add, woe to the person who harms me or my family as I'm not sure I would be in the right mind to wait for the faulty criminal justice system we have.

I am sure you would badly like to convince us, rh, because you helped convict a man in a trial that was manifestly unfair, and are going to passively observe the state's killing him. But you won't get to wipe your conscience clean here.

rh let me point out that we have established no attorney privilege in this conversation. If you say anything further here, and it is even marginally helpful to Mr. Cooper, I will personally deliver all of your comments to Mr. Cooper's defense team and encourage them to subpoena you.

Returning again and again to the victims and the horrible nature of the crime just inflames the discussion. If any visitors to this page would like to convert hearts and minds, prove to me that this defendant was convicted in a fair trial, in a fair and unracist venue, with non-tainted, non-circumstantial evidence.

Six of the jurors, including the foreman, submitted statements to the Governor against the execution based on what they now know of the heinous police misconduct in the case. These people know every bit of the evidence, and they are sad for the victims too, but they are telling you, and we are telling you, Kevin Cooper should not die.

California Supreme Court denies Cooper's latest appeal in a six to zero ruling on the merits.

http://www.reuters.com/newsArticle.jhtml?type=domesticNews&storyID=4297199

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/chronicle/archive/2004/02/06/EDGV34P6UT1.DTL

Former Cooper supporter and defense team member speaks up on the latest developments in the case:

"It proves, beyond any shadow of a doubt, that Kevin Cooper was involved in the murders..."

U.S. District Court for Norther District of California denies Copper's request for injunction based on Cruel and Unusual punishment argument.

http://www.cand.uscourts.gov/cand/judges.nsf/5bad77aa69d3fd7d88256d480060b717/532735976af75c3a88256e32005c0f97?OpenDocument

zagg, or whoever - is that it, or are there more appeals after the District Court and Cal Supreme denials? Can they go to the 9th Circuit?

That wasn't me. But I don't know what other options there are.

My understanding is the "somebody else did it- he's innocent" arguments ended with the California Supreme Court.

He can appeal the "cruel and unusual punishment" argument to the 9th circuit and the U.S. Supreme Court, however, the U.S. Supreme Court has already ruled that Lethal Injection is not cruel and unusual.

I CAN'T JUDGE THIS MAN ON HIS ACTION, BUT I DO SEE THAT HE IS GUILTY FOR RAPING AND TRYING TO STAB A YOUNG GIRL TO DEATH AND THEN HE RIGHTS ALL THESE NOTES, AND HE ESCAPED FROM A MENTAL WARD. HE SIMPLY SHOULD BE HELD FOR WHATEVER HE HAS DONE. I FEEL HE SHOULD STAY IN JAIL FOR THE REST OF HIS LIFE, .........IO JUST CAN'T GET OVER BEING IN A MENTAL PLACE AND WRITING ALL THESE LETTERS ABOUT HIMSELF ON THE NET.COME ON DUDE.....OH, WELL JUST PRAY................

Hey, I am a student at CABRILLO HIGH SHOOL and i just heard about this guy KEVIN COOPER and the crime that people whant me to believe, but I think that Cooper is not guilty because there are many hoops and holes in this cas. I know this becasue one of my teachers told our class about it. I did not know about this "CRIME" till today i havent heard or dean it on a t.v or radio. why? I dont know. Maybe the whit man doestn wnat us to know what is happening out there. At my school there was a riot, again the name of the school is CABRILLO HIGH. It was very crasy there was bottles and trash cans trown every where. there was a fight between LATINOS and BLACKS. why? i dont konw but it was based on racist because the white man sees us the rest as a threat so they hve to start something to try to keep us apart and fighting each other, we should be helping each other adn fight against the white man and his system. i think that the cas with cooper is based on rasism also because he is black. when have u heard or seen a white man be charged with the death penalty?.... NEVER!!! the main ones who actually been penalized with the deatch penalty were latinos and black never hve i seen a white man benn charged with the death penalty.

Richard Allen Davis is white he got the death penalty.

David Westerfield is white, he got the death penalty.

william Bonner was white and he was executed in California.

Robert Harris was white and he was executed in California.

Ward Weaver is white, he got the death penalty.

What do they have in common beside getting the death penalty? They all killed children. Just like Mr. Cooper.

The lesson to be learned here isn't that the system is racist, its that the system, just like society in general, gets REALLY angry when somebody kills an innocent child, and people who do so, will pay the ultimate penalty.

This is to say nothing of the dozens of "notorious" white serial killers and mass murderers who are now or previously have been given the death penalty as a sentance throughout the country. (Dahmer, Bundy, Gacy, Manson, McVeigh, Gary Gilmore, Jack Trawick, etc etc etc...)

There is extensive research on who gets the death penalty. It is not the race of the offender that is most determinative, it is the race of the victim. If you kill white people, you are far more likely to get the death penalty no matter what your race or ethnicity.

There is one more factor. Most of the variance in who gets the death penalty is based on the state and city where the crime is committed and prosecuted. I live in Texas, so I see it first hand.

In the case of Mr. Cooper, there appears to be sufficient evidence to order a new trial. Does that mean he is not a scary person with a history of violence and mental illness? No, it does not. But the fact that he has a history of violence and mental illness does not mean he is guilty of this crime.

I too want the killer(s) caught and punished. Don't we all agree on that?

In California, there have been 11 executions since the reinstatement of the death penatly in the mid 70's. Only one was black. Mr. Cooper will be the second. Enough on race already.

Nationally, 8 whites have been executed for killing blacks since the resumption of the death penalty more than 2 decades ago. Conversely, 124 blacks have been put to death for killing whites, according to the Death Penalty Information Center in Washington. U.S. Justice Department statistics show that in interracial cases, blacks kill whites 2.5 times as often as whites kill blacks, a difference dwarfed by the 15:1 ratio above... If you are white, basically you can kill a black man or woman and feel almost 100 percent secure that you're not going to get the death penalty for it. (zagg)

Kathleen:

His previous crimes don't make him guilty of this one.

The fact that he was convicted beyond a reasonable doubt and on now 7 different occasions appeals courts have affirmed that conviction make him guilty of this crime.

Amnesty International Report: Death by discrimination - the continuing role of race in capital cases.

Much more here.

More recently, Cooper was given another execution perk: he could choose anything he wanted for his last meal. He told the authorities he didn't want a last meal. He has since been offered psychiatrists and priests by the very system that is planning to kill him. "For all these people to suddenly start caring about whether or not I'm alright, asking me, 'Are you alright? Do you want to talk to us?' I find this ludicrous. I find this insane. So I refuse to participate in these rituals," Cooper told us.

Most devastating of all was a pre-execution search for veins in his arms by medical staff, for which he refused to roll up his sleeves. This occurred just a few hours before our lengthy interview on Feb. 2. "So they pushed my sleeves up, and they checked my arms, and they found my veins," Cooper told the radio audience. "But then they said, 'Wait a minute, we have to make sure.' They put me in a holding cage, went and got some tourniquets. Then [the doctor] started massaging my arm and my hand, trying to see if he could find my veins. I looked at him and asked, 'Isn't this against the Hippocratic oath that you take as a doctor against killing people?'" He said, 'I'm not killing you. I'm just checking for your veins.'"

I find the comments and logic proposed by the anti-death penalty people to be truly absurd. I appreciate your cause but hitching your wagon to a murdering rapist like Kevin Cooper seems crazy. I am sure there are cases out there that warrant further review, this is not one of them. I also find the martyrdom of Kevin Cooper to be reprehensible. He seems to blame everyone but himself, including the "man." When one person on his side stops trivializing the innocent people he slaughtered and takes on responsiblity for the acts committed, we will be on the road to a better place

Race is not an issue for me when it comes to this case. If Kevin Cooper was white, I would feel the same way. I never claimed that he was innocent. I only claim that there are a lot of unanswered questions. I've been reading up on this case for many years, been following it and have felt the same way through the years. Something stinks.

I do know that if me or someone I cared about was on deathrow and issues came up that needed resolving, damn straight...I want them resolved, one way or the other.

We live with a justice system that believes that a person is innocent if there is a reasonable doubt. If he had had a fair trial and there was not so much evidence overlooked and mishandled, then I'd say, ok. But there is reasonable doubt that he is not guilty.

I, we...have a responsiblity and privilege as citizens of the United States to see that an innocent person doesn't die over a crime he didn't commit.

Smarten up people...get over the emotion of the case and start being logical.

As a religious Catholic, Gov. Schwarzenegger might have publicly acknowledged that Pope John Paul II declared in his encyclical "Evangelium Vitae" (The Gospel of Life) that, as a practical matter, executions cannot be justified in modern times. That was in 1995. What are the teachings of the great religions of the world on this subject? That, too, would be a worthy question to pursue.

"The death penalty has no legitimate place in the penal system of modern civilized societies," Peter Schieder, an Austrian lawmaker who presides at the parliamentary assembly of the Council of Europe, the continent's leading human rights guardian, wrote Monday in an open letter to Schwarzenegger. Schieder also called on Schwarzenegger to reconsider his decision to let Cooper die. Other leaders, including Foreign Minister Benita Ferrero-Waldner, have also criticized Schwarzenegger's stance on the matter. "I was really happy when Arnold Schwarzenegger became governor of California," Ferrero-Waldner said Tuesday. "But I must say, I am really disappointed."

Riverside has the highest number of inmates per capita on death row, with 54. A statistically proportionate number would be slightly more than 30...The only county with more condemned inmates is Los Angeles, the state’s most populated, with 193 — 11 more than expected under the 1 to 54,700 ratio.

Jackson said he will seek a meeting with Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger, who has already decided not to grant clemency. "(The governor) could not know as much as these six (jurors who have expressed doubts). "Why is there this rush to kill, with so many questions? All the evidence must be weighed." He said a justice system that is often "flawed" cannot always come to the right conclusion.

I only recently have been seeking information on this case. The defense seemed to have some very good points and so I wrote to the governor to ask

for more light to be shed on this case before the defendant is executed. I am glad to have found this site and been referred to more information on the prosecution's case against the defendant.

What I have read so far is very compelling in implicating Mr. Cooper. I intend to become more informed.

I have one question. No one has mentioned if Josh Ryen was ever helped with any therapy after

this horrible event. And in particular, if anyone used hypnotherapy to try to help him. I know from what he has written that he spends a lot of time alone and with his memories.

I asked an esteemed teacher of hypnotherapy, Marleen Mulder,one of the founders of the Hynotherapy Training Institute in N.Calif., about the use of this therapy for crime victims. She said that it is very subjective and that the best approach is a healing approach. When the intent is to heal the patient, in the process, the memories of the event are released. This is a much better way to work than encouraging the patient to remember details of the crime.

She also mentioned the use of hypnotherapy in solving the Chowchilla kidnapping.

9th circuit court of appeals rules that 'new evidence' in cooper habeus corpus appeal lacks any probative value. Execution is to proceed.

http://www.ca9.uscourts.gov/ca9/Documents.nsf/54dbe3fb372dcb6c88256ce50065fcb8/973892d910002c7788256e320075ee1e/$FILE/Cooper_SOS_Order.pdf

Ninth Circuit also rules lethal injection is not cruel or unusual punishment.

http://www.ca9.uscourts.gov/ca9/Documents.nsf/54dbe3fb372dcb6c88256ce50065fcb8/973892d910002c7788256e320075ee1e/$FILE/Cooper_TRO_opinion.pdf

The thing that bugs me most about this is that the victims are always forgotten. The evidence leans heavily to this guy committing this horrendous crime. Those of you who so much sympathy for the perpetrator, pls, pls, pls give some thoughts to the victims.

If the debate is about the death penalty, fine, it's an honest discussion. But to pose innocence as little more than a sham to support a social agenda is less than honorable. The evidence is overwhelming -- he was next door by his own admission, he was at the crime scene by his own DNA results -- he did it. He has to pay, either with his life for those who support the death penalty, or his life in prison for those who do not. Kevin Cooper will pay for his crime and although I might also be interested in an honest debate regarding capital punishment, those who push the "no punishment, he's innocent" alternative are totally out the door.

First off my deepest condolenses with the family and victims of this horrific act and may God walk & comfort you during this ordeal that has resurfaced in your lives.

I RECENTLY moved here to California and I am originally from Alabama so please, try and bear with me as I only have knowledge of the case through the public transcripts, opinions and other "so-called" evidence I could gather from media, papers and on the internet.

I am African American. I am 1 of 2 sole survivors of a brutal triple murder that happened to my family. The convicted killer was Caucasian. In this situation, the act of which the barbaric violence was committed is irrelevant to SKIN COLOR period. Racism is not the culprit in this case (IMHO) and being from the deep south and having witnesses racism in it's most vicious forms I think I qualify my remarks here. Come on people, using race here as a basis of this guy’s innocence is ridiculous and preposterous.

However,

There are some issues here that "may" warrant a second look but if the EVIDENCE is overwhelming then there should be closure. Death is wrong, no matter who does it, but I can tell you first hand that if you've never had a family member brutally murdered then you would never truly know the pain that must be endured reliving the entire ordeal through media frenzy and high profiles debates and protests.

If he's innocent, he should live and the state should admit incompetence. But if he's guilty he should gracefully take the punishment set forth by the jury of his peers as a resultant of evidence that proves his guilt without a "reasonable doubt".

Either way, let JUSTICE be done.

God Bless

Fresh appeals to halt the execution will be made Monday to Mr. Schwarzenegger, the United States attorney in Los Angeles, the California attorney general and the United States Court of Appeals for the Ninth Circuit.

Judge James R. Browning, dissented, saying that Cooper did not have a fair trial.

"There should be no hurry to execute Cooper. If he is truly guilty, these simple tests will resolve the matter. If he is truly innocent, those same tests will tell us that," Browning wrote. "When the stakes are so high, when the evidence against Cooper is so weak, and when the newly discovered evidence of the State's malfeasance and misfeasance is so compelling, there is no reason to hurry and every reason to find out the truth."

The jurors said they want a stay of the execution, which is scheduled for Tuesday, so that hair and blood evidence they claim was unavailable at the time can be tested.

Father Chris Ponnet, former clergy at the Hughes family's Catholic Church, has been leading an anti-death penalty vigil for Cooper and has been fasting for a week in protest. Father Ponnet says: "The pain of their loss, no one can undo, whether in a church service or an execution."

Father Ponnet plans to say Mass tomorrow at noon for Kevin Cooper and all on death row. (c/o Death Penalty Focus)

I haven't found links for these, but heard that the priest at Schwarzenegger's church, the president of Austria and a Mayor from Austria have all asked him to grant the stay.

Oh wait, here it is:

Austrians Protest 'Native Son' Schwarzenegger's Death Sentence Policy

Why did the prosecutors withhold evidence from the jury? How did one man murder an entire famil with only a knife? Who were those WHITE GUYS, coverd in blood, that showed up at a local bar shortly after the murders? Why didn't the prosecutors test the BLOND HAIR found in the grasp of the dead little girl?

Sorry folks but putting an innocent man to death doesn't make society safer.....It makes it more dangerous.

I remember kevin from pittsburgh,he was always a gentleman. the governor is now living up to his name "the terminator" if he executes kevin,may he never sleep in peace.May the heavens open up their arms for Kevin. May the gates of hell be ready for the governor if he does this.

While Esther Cooper, 74, lives thousands of miles from the state that will take their son's life, she still searches for answers, hangs on to hope and believes passionately in his innocence. "I can't describe how I feel, it's torment, and I keep (asking) why,' Esther Cooper said, crying. She still lives in Pittsburgh, where Kevin Cooper was raised. "He may have been done wrong when he was younger, but I'm telling you he did not kill those people and God knows my son is innocent.'

You all realize that this "innocent gentleman" also is wanted in Pennsylvania for Kidnapping, raping, stabbing and leaving another young woman for dead.

And Yes, I’m sure his mom thinks that there is no way her son could have killed those people... like all mothers would.

"What about the blond hair?" As previously mentioned, most likely animal hair from the horses or other animals.

"How did one man murder an entire family with only a knife?" He didn't, he used an Icepick and a hatchet as well. The sheath for that hatchet was found in the house where cooper was staying.

"But there where witnesses and reports of multiple people" Then why were the shoe prints only of one type and size of Coopers shoe from Chino prison(where he just escaped).

I wont even get into the DNA because I know you all think either the police are raciest and/or incompetent, no point trying to reason with you.

Save your sympathy for the victims, not the monster.

Appeals court grants stay to Kevin Cooper.

I am having such a very hard time with all that I have been reading. Where was everyone 20 years ago?? When the pain was so bad it hurt to take a breath? The Ryens were like family to me. I worked for them helping care for the horses that they loved so much, babysitting their two wonderful children who were so full of life, and house sitting and caring for all of thier animals that they cared for.

It makes my stomach turn to think that there is even a chance that Cooper will still be a live tomarrow. No one..I mean no one can understand the pain unless they have gone through it. I was close to the Ryen family, yet I am an outsider. I have lost them all forever. I t is hard to lose someone close to you but to lose them in such a horrible way never goes away. I think of Doug, Peg and Jessica everyday. I prey that Josh will find happines and peace in his life. He and his Grandmother are so lucky to have each other. I know that Josh has many more family members that truely love him and this will always be there for him.

Do you people not understand that everytime something comes up, be it DNA testing, interviews..whatever..the pain starts all over again as deep and painful as it ever was.

I truely belive tha Kevin Cooper did this!! I believe that he took my dear friends away from their son, family, friends and from me!! How dare he! How dare you tell me and anyone else who has this pain that will always be there that this man did not do this. He asked for the DNA testing...he got it!! Let this chapter in all of our lifes close so hopefully healing can begin.

I did not know the Hughes family well, I met them and I knew Christopher. My heart breaks for them. I wish for them happiness and healing.

I am proud to say that I was a friend of Doug, Peg, Jessica and Josh. I am a better person for knowing them. I miss them everyday and will always remember them.

A panel, drawn at random and headed by Chief Judge Mary Schroeder, will hear new evidence uncovered in the case, perhaps within hours. Cooper could still face the death penalty tomorrow at 12:01 a.m. as planned, or he could be rescheduled to another day if his appeals are not successful. "We're not celebrating yet," said Lanny Davis, a member of Cooper's defense team...A new ruling, based on arguments that prosecutors and Cooper's lawyers will present through e-mail and possibly conference calls, likely could be decided within hours today. The outcome, regardless of which side the court favors, is expected to be appealed to the U.S. Supreme Court, which has made several decisions throughout the years that advanced Cooper's execution..."That's the way these things work," a spokesman for the 9th Circuit said today. "You don't quit until there's no more venues for you to pursue."

I truely belive tha Kevin Cooper did this!! I believe that he took my dear friends away from their son, family, friends and from me!! How dare he! How dare you tell me and anyone else who has this pain that will always be there that this man did not do this. He asked for the DNA testing...he got it!! Let this chapter in all of our lifes close so hopefully healing can begin.

But what if what everyone supporting Cooper is saying is true? What if the misconduct did take place--if the police did mishandle the evidence? What if tests show that the evidence was tampered with in an attempt to firm up a wrongful conviction?

You made it clear that you truly believe Cooper did this, but there's obviously a lot of people who respectfully disagree with that.

Several times here people have made reference to the fact that no one is talking about the Ryens and Hughes. That is true. The main reason is because everything everyone is saying is that Cooper DID NOT DO THESE THINGS.

With that being our frame of reference, the Ryens and Hughes are not part of the equation because we're saying that Cooper had nothing to do with that.

Everyone impacted by the original crime certainly had to go through a terrible, terrible ordeal. No one has ever denied that. What separates us is that you are holding to the belief that Cooper did do it while we are rejecting that.

You are saying that killing Cooper is a way of closing old wounds. We are saying that killing Cooper is ANOTHER wrong, added on top of the original horrific event.

But on a tangent, as much as people have come here and cried for vengeance as a way of healing the wounds of 20 years ago, I think people may also find that if Cooper (or someone else) is eventually executed, those wounds will still be there. I can't say that from personal experience, but legions of families of murder victims have come forth after executions realizing that the death penalty didn't resolve anything for them.

For those saying that people who have never been through something like this can never understand it may be right. But there are others that have seen loved ones lost that maintain an anti-death penalty stance. Namely, the Murder Victims' Families for Reconciliation.

I respect those whom do not belive in the death pently...but in return I expect the same. Kevin Coopers death will not make my pain go away, but I believe that it will let the healing begin.

This is what I believe and I have thought long and hard about it for many years.

I read through this whole list of messages - no one commented further on the one survivor's statement that it was three people, and that none of them were black. Does he still say this?

I read through this whole list of messages - no one commented further on the one survivor's statement that it was three people, and that none of them were black. Does he still say this?

No. He no longer says this. This is allegedly what he said at the time of the crime.

When asked how many people there were, Josh repeatedly gave the same answer. "He responded that there were three people," says Sharp. Josh gave even greater details to psychiatrist Lorna Forbes. From her notes: "Three Mexicans chased us around the house. Tried to fight them off. They came and hit me." While he was at the Loma Linda University Medical Center, Josh told that story to at least five people. But even more significant was the fact that when Cooper's picture was broadcast on the news, Josh didn't recognize the man, says Mary. While he recuperated, Josh still maintained there were three attackers. But a year and a half later, when Josh, with his grandmother at his side, was asked about the murders, he said he didn't remember three attackers.

The deal:

There was no indication how long the stay would last. Cooper's death warrant is valid for 24 hours, beginning a minute after midnight Tuesday, meaning he could be executed immediately if the court lifts its stay during that time period. If the stay is in place beyond the 24-hour period, an execution would not take place for at least 40 days, assuming Cooper loses his appeal, while a lower court sets a new execution date.

Bottom line--if the hearing takes place today or tomorrow, Cooper could still be executed any time on Tuesday if he loses.

If the hearing doesn't take place by 12:01 AM Wednesday, then Cooper could not be executed until a new date is scheduled, again should he lose.

If he wins, I don't know what happens. Obviously the execution is off. I dunno what that does in terms of exonerating him.

Angela Davis

More protest photos & audio interviews here.

Dear All

I am French speaking Swiss citizen and I am writing to you from Germany where I am living with my American wife at the present time.

Please excuse me if my English is not perfect.

I would like to thank-you for your very informative forum about Kevin Cooper.

The diffent views of the users of your forum are very interesting to observe.

I can tell you that in Europe people are horrified with what is going on in the USA, China and Iran (top 3) with death penalty, simply because it is against the Human Rights.

So the guilt or not guilt of Kevin Cooper doesn't have much importance in Europe.

Kevin Cooper's planed execution is seen as an extremist barbaric action, from the viewpoint of the majority of the population, opinion leaders and politicians in Europe.

Some people will tell me that this not of our business.

I would answer as a friend of the USA that if the USA want to be leader in the world in a effective way (military, politics, economics, culture etc), they should make an effort to listen to the opinion of the rest of the world in order to have a good Image and good Public Relations.

Without good PR no business is effective, this is a basic.

Death Penalty is the worse Public Relation action one could think of (Not talking about making the Iraq-war without UN decision and based on WMDs lies). Every executed Human in the USA is making the Image of the USA go down in the European Public Opinion eyes.

It seems that Americans are still not aware that we, from outside of America, can observe you and have an opinion.

That is why I wrote Mr. Schwarzenegger, as many other European did, to tell him my disagreement on the execution of Mr. Cooper.

If you do not stop death penalty because of basic Human Rights understanding, do it in order to stop the pulic relation disaster your country is facing in the rest of the world.

Thank-you for taking time reading my message.

Best Regards

Yann Aubert

This is a letter I wrote to Arnold, I hope it helps!

Dear Mr. Schwarzenegger, February 6, 2004

I am a Canadian mother of an eight-year-old child. I can only imagine the pressure someone in your position must be faced with on a daily basis. You are not only a governor of state, but also a role model to children across the world. I am writing you about a live show I watched on Court TV. I was very upset by it. It concerned a man by the name of Cooper.

I know nothing of this man’s case; I do however watch Court TV on a regular basis. I know that the advancements in today’s forensic science are astonishing. This man Cooper has been accused and convicted of murdering three people. Understandably, he has been given the death sentence.

What I am upset about is this man has been on death row for 16-17 years, which as I understand is extremely costly. He is sentenced to be executed on February 10, 2004. The show has stated the little girl murdered in this case was holding a considerable amount of blonde hair.

I have watched many episodes of Forensic Files and seen how little of hair can be used through DNA testing to convict a criminal. After many years of paying for a criminal on death row, I do not see why a few more dollars could not be spent when a human life is about to be terminated. A man is about to be killed for wrongfully taking of the lives of three others. Why not take an extra week to be sure the state is not also wrongfully taking the life of another.

If this man is innocent, it will become a double tragedy. Not only will another innocent life be wasted, but also potentially three murders are left roaming. They will be confident in their ability to murder and get away with it. These three are then left to possibly kill again. I do not envy your position. The system is only good if it works. With today’s technology there is no reasons to be killing people without being 100% sure an individual is guilty. When evidence is clearly present and testable, this is clearly a case of laziness and neglect.

This decision initially may not have been yours, but you are a last course of action. Simply by taking the responsibility of governor it is truly your job to represent all of your people. You are failing in your job not only as governor but also as a role model to the world as a whole. You are not just affecting your state. We are following and watching you all around the world. I am sure being careless with a life is not the image you wish to present. This man may be guilty. But killing him without being sure is wrong. You are now looked up to be many different groups. The people in your state, your fans as an actor, weightlifters…you touch a lot of peoples lives. You are watched through the eyes of me, my daughter, and the world at large. I beg you to reconsider, and just double check to be sure this is your man.

What could it hurt?

Angela Day

Brechin, Ontario

Another note on the "blond hair".

The hair that was recovered stuck to her hand had no roots, so it wasn’t pulled from anyone’s head, but most likely cut. She received a large number of cuts to the head, quite possible it was her own hair (One investigator who examined the hair said it was darker than in the photo.)

Kevin Cooper was tried and convicted according to our legal system. He has had 21 years to appeal and is alive. The Ryens are DEAD, they can't speak for themselves. It is time. The Governor is correct. Let justice be done. We lost four great people 21 years ago,in a very brutal and horrifying way, This will haunt many of us for the rest of our lives.

Appeals court bars Cooper execution

That was fast. The 11-judge panel convened and barred the execution and set the stage possibly for Cooper to get a fresh trial.

California is appealing the 9th Circuit's decision to the U.S. Supreme Court.

You guys ought to read the news.

In a 9-2 ruling on Monday afternoon, the en banc panel continued the stay to allow Kevin Cooper's lawyers to submit more materials to a lower court. Cooper attorney Lanny Davis: "What this means is that for the very first time, one court and one neutral fact-finder can hear all of the evidence that the jury was not allowed to hear. This suggests not only that Kevin Cooper can be found innocent once and for all, but that there may be three murderers out there who need to be found and prosecuted."

to everyone who said the DNA testing proved Kevin Cooper's guilt - there is a strong possibility it was tampered with and was not correct. and if there's any chance at all, even if it is almost impossible, shouldn't the evidence be reconsidered rather than taking even the smallest chance that an innocent man is being killed?

A strong possibility... Really... From what I heard, there were many observers that witnessed the testing to make sure these accusations wouldnt come up.

Right. Guess you didn't 'hear' that the investigator who found the DNA evidence implicating Cooper was using narcotics at the time of the trial, and was later fired for stealing heroin from a police evidence locker. And you didn't 'hear' that the blood evidence in question was checked out overnight in 1999 by a criminalist (who admitted on the stand at the trial falsifying Cooper's test results) along with an actual sample of Cooper's blood, along with a cigarette butt and a swab of Cooper's saliva. Or that a bloody shoe print on a bedsheet introduced at the trial had subsequently been cut out of the sheet. Or that the same shoe print, which was not found until after investigators focused on Cooper, matched not only Cooper's shoes but also a pair kept by investigators.

I don't know anything about this case. I only know what I've read here and a few other sites. After reading all sides I have a couple of questions that lets say a jury would want to know.

*Did Josh Ryen really make a statement of seeing 3 white or Latino men kill his family? If so was his statement later changed and if so why?

*Was the blonde hair found in one of the victims hand ever DNA tested to determine it's origin? If not why not?

*Did someone really have access to the evidence for 24 hours without a court order or the defense's knowledge? And did this person really admit to changing the results?

I really believe questions like these should be answered with hard facts not opinions. If I were a jury member I could not condemn someone with out some solid answers to these questions.

I'm really not for or against Mr. Cooper but further or new DNA testing could really shut everybody up, especially on this blonde hair issue.

This afternoon's 9th Circuit order is excellent, and quite damning to the prosecution.

In particular, after a detailed discussion of the footprint evidence, including two new sworn declarations, the Court concludes that the prosecution may have violated its constitutional duty to provide exculpatory evidence to the defense. By burying this evidence, "the State was able to tell a damaging story about the presence of a bloody 'Pro-Ked Dude' footprint only Cooper, an escaped prisoner, could have left. But if Warden Carroll had been put on the stand and had been believed by the jury, the jury would have known that Cooper was almost certainly not wearing 'Pro-Ked Dude' shoes."

One of the new declarations was hand-written by James Taylor, a prosecution witness. The new declaration contradicts Taylor's testimony at trial.

The Court goes into many of the matters discussed above on this page, including Josh Ryen's initial testimony, the blond hairs, and the Roper/Furrow/Koon evidence. The majority mentions two brand new declarants who saw three men high on drugs and splattered with blood at a nearby bar on the night of the murders.

The Court ordered that the blood on the t-shirt should be immediately tested for EDTA. If EDTA is found on the t-shirt, all accusations of police misconduct can be presumed true. Mitochondiral DNA testing on the blond hair, which the defense believes will exclude the victims and possibly implicate the real killer(s), was also ordered.

Also significant for Cooper's team: the Court's order specifically permits a second or successive habeas corpus applications in the District court.

Comment for Xowie, Just wondering, why do you suppose he was hanging out at the rental house? Remember, he did admit to being there...Oh and then there were the calls he made to his girl friends home from the same house...Let's not forget the car he took from the Ryen's home after the murders (his "hair" was later found in the back seat)Remember this is the same house that a couple of the murder weapons were found to have come from. Xowie, You can try and create different reasons as to why he couldn't have commited the murders,but the bottom line is dosn't the fact that he admitted to being there and calling his girl friend bother you in the least? It would be one thing if he was in another state or someone elses DNA was found etc... but he was there! The whole right place at the wrong time is completly absurd and all to convient...Please respond. Thank you.

Cooper was next door and needed a car to escape. The Ryens' car was later found in Long Beach with Cooper's cigarette butts inside (according to DNA results). Ryens' blood and hair were found in traps in the drains of the next-door house where Cooper holed up and later cleaned up after his crime. Police did not have access to Cooper for at least six weeks, making it impossible to plant evidence at the crime scene. He had a past history of violent crime and it was a violent rape (with a knife in hand) that eventually led to his being caught in Mexico. It all adds up. The evidence of his guilt is overwhelming. And as for the comment by Joshua that there were "three men -- Latinos" who attacked him and his family and the Hughes boy, a key police investigator in the case explained that this came early on. While Joshua was still in the hospital recovering the investigator asked him if there were any people that his family had come into contact with recently who might have done this. He mentioned three Latinos who approached his father earlier, looking for work. That was the genesis of the "three men" theory. He always described the attacker as having "bushy hair". If you want to believe this guy is innocent, go ahead, don't let the facts or the evidence get in the way. If you want to argue that the death penalty is wrong, go ahead. But argue that and stop hiding behind presumed innocence after reasonable doubt has been long removed. Personally, I am not a big fan of capital punishment, but I am even less a fan of injustice when it conveniently meets the social agenda of those opposing the death penalty.

The 9th Circuit Court seriously discusses the possibility of other perpetrators. Two of them are mentioned by name in the Court's order. One of those men has a criminal record which includes violent assault. There is a lot of other evidence suggesting that the crime was the work of a group, as you surely know.

A prison town like Chino is full of parolees and their friends. It is certainly not absurd to think that more than one violent criminal might be loose in a particular neighborhood on a given night. Excluding the confession and other evidence to that effect made the case against Cooper look much worse than it is.

According to the 9th Circuit Court of Appeals, only three pieces of evidence connect Kevin Cooper with the Ryen house, and all three are in question and possibly tainted. The death penalty absolutely should not apply unless this defendant was convicted in a fair trial, in an unracist venue, with non-tainted, non-circumstantial evidence. Was Kevin Cooper was involved or not, I can't say. However, it is starting to look pretty clear that he didn't have a fair trial.

I respect those whom do not belive in the death pently...but in return I expect the same. Kevin Coopers death will not make my pain go away, but I believe that it will let the healing begin.

This is what I believe and I have thought long and hard about it for many years.

Dee, there is something very wrong about the fact that we live in a society in which someone can be killed to allow for YOUR healing.

Whether or not Mr. Cooper is guilty or innocent, it is not our place to avenge the deaths of others by killing him.

That's not healing, that's revenge. That's displacement.

not interested in relly debating this at this time. i'm sure none if us has all the correct info to begin with re either side & we're all going to stick with our own opinions anyway, BUT can anyone tell me (can't find it anywhere right now) why was cooper in jail in the first place, why'd he escape or how much longer did he have to go & i keep hearing he got caught becasue of some rape but can't find that info.....Eight300109@aol

Personally, I am not a big fan of capital punishment, but I am even less a fan of injustice when it conveniently meets the social agenda of those opposing the death penalty.

If one is opposed to the death penalty in all cases, does that preclude talking of innocence in instances where that specific argument is applicable?

If I thought Cooper was guilty, I'd still argue against his execution, but on entirely different grounds.

But as it turns out, this is a case that clearly has not been resolved. It's not longer a rhetorical argument. The courts have agreed with that. The courts are clearly disagreeing with everyone on this thread who has said the case is closed and that all the evidence was out and that Cooper got a fair trial.

Peter Schieder appeals for clemency in the case of death row inmate Kevin Cooper

Strasbourg, Feb.2004 - In a letter to Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger, Council of Europe Parliamentary Assembly President Peter Schieder today appealed for clemency in the case of death row inmate Kevin Cooper:

‘Since you took office as Governor, you have shown mercy and humanity in supporting decisions by the California Board of Prison Terms to set free apparently rehabilitated murderers. Yet on Friday you rejected a clemency appeal from death row inmate Kevin Cooper.

As President of the Parliamentary Assembly of the 45-member nation Council of Europe and as a fellow Austrian, I appeal to you in the name of mercy and humanity to stay the execution of Kevin Cooper set for 10 February.

The Council of Europe is completely opposed to capital punishment. It considers that the death penalty has no legitimate place in the penal systems of modern civilized societies, and that its application constitutes torture and inhuman or degrading punishment within the meaning of Article 3 of the European Convention on Human Rights.

The Council of Europe believes that the imposition of the death penalty has proved ineffective as a deterrent and, owing to the possible fallibility of human justice, also tragic through the execution of innocent people.

I would like to recall that the willingness to institute an immediate moratorium on executions and to abolish the death penalty in the long term have become, since 1994, preconditions for accession to the Council of Europe. As a result, the 45 countries which make up the Council of Europe have been a de facto death penalty-free zone since 1997. The Parliamentary Assembly considers that the same standard applies to countries enjoying Observer status with the Council of Europe, including the United States of America.

Once again, I appeal to you to show clemency in this case.’

Contact:

Council of Europe Parliamentary Assembly Communication Unit

Tel. +33 3 88 41 50 26, fax +33 3 90 21 41 34, e-mail: assembly.news@coe.int

I dont know the Ryen's but I went to school with Christopher Hughes. if all the people here would just think of what they're doing when the try to save this man, you are heartlessly rubbing salt into the wounds of the family and friends of the victims. the have been made to suffer for too long. this new hearing will only set in stone the facts on which the original verdict was given. I believe in the death penalty , it is a necessary part of the juditial system and in this case it is much deserved. NO ONE especially someones Parents should not EVER have to live through the HORROR that Mr. Hughes was put through the day he found his son and neighbors. ......

Nobody is forcing the victim's family and friends, you included, to visit randomWalks or read our advocacy on behalf of a condemned prisoner who has a plausible claim of actual innocence. If one of your friends or family were unfairly accused of a capital crime, you'd be happy there are people like us around.

Since that's not the case, I suggest you leave this website and never come back. Have a nice day.

I'm not certain whether Kevin is guilty but I am certain that if we execute Kevin that the state of California (and all of its residents) will be guilty of pre-meditated murder. The death penalty is a cruel act of vengeance that serves no useful purpose. Why can't we settle on a life sentence? Do you really want the state to continue using gas chambers, electric chairs, and poison to execute?

source: http://www.northernsun.com/nsm/images/thumb/1867Penalty.jpg

"I dont know the Ryen's but I went to school with Christopher Hughes. if all the people here would just think of what they're doing when the try to save this man, you are heartlessly rubbing salt into the wounds of the family and friends of the victims. the have been made to suffer for too long. this new hearing will only set in stone the facts on which the original verdict was given. I believe in the death penalty , it is a necessary part of the juditial system and in this case it is much deserved. NO ONE especially someones Parents should not EVER have to live through the HORROR that Mr. Hughes was put through the day he found his son and neighbors. ......"

I'm sorry, but I don't understand how killing another person, especially one with a strong possibility of being innocent, will help the family and friends of those who were killed. I feel terrible for them and wish this horrendous type of crime could be avoided, but will continuing to kill bring back the dead? What do we think the death penalty could accomplish that would ease the suffering of the victims' families?

As someone already said, the death penalty isn't a healing solution, its revenge, and its no better than the first murders.

Have the Ameropathic Racist Cops ever been known to plant evidense and frame black people?

Oh they do it all the time... huh?

This is just a ritual murder, a hitech lynching.

Lets hypothetically say that the cops planted all of the evidence to frame poor Cooper. Wouldnt that mean that theres some rogue band of killers on the loose slaughtering people at random? Being that wasnt the case and there were no additional murders in the area after Coopers arrest-wouldnt that lead one to believe that Cooper did, gasp, commit the crimes?

Advocate the Abolishment of the Death Penalty all you want but pick a better poster boy for it then Cooper. Its an admirable goal but a poor choice of examples in Cooper.

Racist/Dirty Cops exist but do you really think when police arrived at the crime scene and found a family murdered the first thing they thought was "This is great because We can now pin this on an innocent Black Guy." Cmon, its a ludicrous scenario.

Cooper is either guilty as heck or the worlds unluckiest man. I tend to believe in the latter.

Also, did anyone ever post Coopers Arrest Record? Id like to see what other unlucky events happened to this poor man thats somehow made him a victim....not the family that was murdered by his hand IMO.

For a "voice of reason," you sure make a lot of silly arguments.

Wouldnt that mean that theres some rogue band of killers on the loose slaughtering people at random?

Um, no.

All it would mean is that someone else committed this crime.

Racist/Dirty Cops exist but do you really think when police arrived at the crime scene and found a family murdered the first thing they thought was "This is great because We can now pin this on an innocent Black Guy." Cmon, its a ludicrous scenario.

You've done an excellent job eviscerating that strawman.

Unfortunately, nobody has made this argument.

The argument is about police manipulating evidence and the crime scene after the fact, not then and there.

Cooper is either guilty as heck or the worlds unluckiest man. I tend to believe in the latter.

So you don't believe he's guilt then. Great.

Also, did anyone ever post Coopers Arrest Record? Id like to see what other unlucky events happened to this poor man thats somehow made him a victim....not the family that was murdered by his hand IMO.

Yet another strawman.

This is not about the crimes Cooper committed or may have committed in the past.

This is about one specific crime of which there is ample evidence that Cooper is innocent.

Xowie and Zagg, Just need to get your opinion...I do respect all the work and time you have spent on this case (by the by) Just want to know what your thoughts on the fact that he made phone calls to his girlfriend from the rental house, which was just next door, before the murders (he admitted to that)After the muders he took the victims car. His DNA in the back seat (pubic hair). Remember very remote area in the hills of Chino and not very accessible to most (perfect place to break into someones home and hide, which is what he admitted to doing "hid in the closet of the unoccupied rental house)Okay, so we have him there before the murders and after the murders...He WASN'T in another state or in prison he WAS there! The Ryens home was off Hwy 71. If you stood at the gates of Chino prison on Central ave. and looked west the Ryens home were the furthest up the hill. At night you could see thier home, a few dim lights, in a very rural area, mostly horse corals and Ranch homes. He escaped from the minimum security yard which was at the front of the prison and hid in the corn field accross the street then worked his way up the hill, probably 4-5 miles....Please, just your opinion on the coincidence with the fact that he was there before and after the murders?

Please, just your opinion on the coincidence with the fact that he was there before and after the murders?

He was there.

I still don't think he did the murders.

I also think all the DNA evidence is extremely suspect. Xowie's addressed that fact a few times. The courts seemed persuaded by this as well.

He was there before and after the murders. He took thier car, in the middle of the night, while the murders were being commited? After the murders? Zagg, you are a very smart man. It really dosn't take a genius to determine guilt or innocence here. How do you suppose he got the keys to the Ryens car? Do you really belive they handed them to him? This is all so simple, he broke into the house, things got out of hand, he killed the family (with items he took from the rental house) Dad was killed first...He needed a way out of Chino...He took the keys and drove to Mexico. The Prison didn't know who had escaped at the time he left the minimum security area. Remember he "checked in" with a false name. When an escape took place they would sound off an alarm and flash a light at the top of a very tall tower to allow the residents to protect themselves and be more aware, but because Cooper gave a false name, the community did not get a warning until 2 days after the escape which is when the murders took place.

I think it's great that you have such a passion for death penalty issues, but Zagg be very honest here, planting evidence and race plays no part here. He was there before and after the murders. He stole thier car to escape...As I said in an earlier comment this was not a public area, it was impossible to happen upon thier home, he knew at some point they would be looking for him so the only lodgical thing to do was to "head for the hills" which is what he did. It's so hard for me to understand why so many are trying to protect a man from his own sin and wrong doing. We all have GOD given free will. I don't have an opinion on the dealth penalty. Frankly, these past few days, I've just tried to make a point about this particular case and the facts that were very clear all the while this was taking place, I worked just accross the street from the prison. It was a very,very frightening time....Zagg, I'm very sure that there is probably innocent men and woman on dealth row, but in this case, Cooper is guilty...No question.

Obviously it is possible that Kevin Cooper occupied the rental house until that night and left town either before or after the murders without being involved or even knowing they occurred. The real murderers might have entered the rental house after the killings or gone back and forth between the houses, bringing Cooper's hairs or DNA traces with them. Cooper might have even had some contact with the real murderers for all we know, before or after the crime, or might have been physically present when the murders occurred but without participating. (Even that would not be a capital crime.)

However, Cooper has always denied that he entered the Ryen house and there is very little evidence that he did. Law enforcement misconduct may well have tainted what little evidence exists. The EDTA test should tell us quite a bit more about that.

I absolutely don't find the coincidence of more than one violent felon in the same area, or even in the same houses, all that surprising in a prison town. (That nearby bar seems to have a lot of patrons covered in blood!) Line of sight from the prison isn't important if the perpetrators were, for example, three felons high on drugs who entered the wrong house by mistake.

ps You've had your say Donna. I don't see any point in us further debating the facts of the case with you. If you continue making lengthy posts here I'm going to have to delete them. Thanks.

donna,

what xowie said.

There's more work to do:

Cooper case ruling will be appealed

State to ask high court to reinstate death penalty

I don't know whether Kevin is guilty or not but I do know that he is a liar and anything he says should be taken with a grain of salt. Back in 1982 he worked for me in a telemarketing room on Hollywood Blvd. for a short while before he just disappeared one day. The next thing I know its six months later and the guy I knew as David Trautman is actually somebody named Kevin Cooper and he's wanted for a brutal murder. At the time he came to work for me his arm was in a sling and he told me it had happened when he got off the bus in downtown LA and was jumped and had his luggage stolen. It wasn't until these murders happened that I found out his story was a complete lie and he had actually injured himself either during his escape in Pennsylvania or during the kidnapping and rape he committed right after, all of which apparently had happened just a few days before he walked into my office. Personally I liked the guy and never saw any indication during the time I knew him that he was a violent person but I wouldn't trust anything he has to say regarding his innocence. He likes to lie.

You don't personally know anything bad about the guy, and choose to slander him here anyway? That's pretty tacky, fella.

Kevin Cooper's Fight to Live by Alan Maass.

LA Weekly: Saved by a hair.

We truly will appreciate your assistance in savving Kevin Cooper's life, and giaving him the justice, freedom and peace that he truly deserves. The complete evidence that athe police had truly proved that Kevin was not involved in the killing of the Ryen Family in CA.

The photo of the hand full of hair that the young girl had of the attacker(s) definitely was not Kevin's.

'The several wweapons that was used to kill the Ryen Family was not used by Kevin.

The lady that took those bloody jeans and a t-shirt to the police, indicated that her boyfriend was involved in the crime, not Kevin.

Lastly, Josh Ryen who was 8 years old at the time also stated Kevin was not involved in murdrding his family.

Again, our whole family will appreciate the saving of Kevin's life and the freedom, peace and happiness that he deserves.

Sincerely,

Phyllis and Melvin Cooper

Mom and Dad

Posted by: Melvin at February 11, 2004 07:36 PM

via zagg

It appears to me that there is too much reasonable doubt that has surfaced during the apellate process. Aside from the conflicting circumstances, witnesses, and time line, the DNA evidence CANNOT LIE. If Mr. Cooper is truly guilty why is he vesting his hope of avoiding execution by appealing for further DNA testing?

There are too many loose ends in this case that need to be settled once and for all, either in behalf of Mr. Cooper's innocence or for his condemnation.

xowie:

You posted earlier in the discussion:

First of all, there is no evidence that this is true.

Only one set of bloody shoeprints were found at the murder scene(the Ryen house). Similar shoeprints were also found in the next-door home(the Lease house) that Cooper was holed up, and they were the only prints discovered there.

If there had been multiple murderers, it stands to reason that you would expect to find multiple bloody shoeprints of various sizes and patterns.

William Baird, the manager of the San Bernardino County sheriff's crime laboratory, compared the shoe print impressions from the Ryen and Lease houses to each other, to the type of shoes issued to defendant, and to other shoes. He concluded that the three shoe prints 'all possessed a similar tread pattern, which would indicate a similar type shoe was used in each case'. They 'are consistent with one another, and ... could have been caused by the same shoe'.

The facts of this case, based on shoeprint evidence, suggests that only one individual committed this horrendous crime ----> Kevin Cooper.

xowie:

This is your comment I was refering to:

> This crime was committed by a crew, not an individual ....

Bad argument, son: "It is quite possible that Baird planted the shoe print in the crime lab, especially considering that he has a well-established record of police corruption. After the trial, he was fired for stealing five pounds of heroin from the evidence locker both for personal use and to sell to drug dealers. By Baird’s own admission he was using narcotics at the time of the trial, at which he delivered important testimony that helped to convict Cooper. Baird was also responsible for finding the second piece of evidence that tied Cooper to the Ryen house: a large blood drop on a wall away from where the murders took place..." (cite)

In fact, Baird's testimony on the footprints and the disgraceful failure of the prosecutors to disclose related exculpatory evidence to the defense is the main reason behind the 9th Circuit Court's stay of the execution. You should read it. You might learn something.

The execution of the accused however is never contingent: it is absolutely final, certain, unalterable, permanent. If evidence is contingent, logically open to reconsideration, fissured, pliable, and humanly malleable, the consequence of the death penalty is the very opposite. If the one is plastic, the other is opaque, one subject to revision, the other fixed forever in its determination. Therefore, no evidence can ever equal in the logic of its claim, the finality of the loss of human existence which it is designed to serve.

To put this bluntly I personaly think that Kevin Cooper should rot in hell for what he did. All of these protestors find it easy to protest against this yet there is one big question what if it were your family that was brutally murdered wouldn't you want justice done. Al these people claiming that there is all this substantial evidence that he didn't do it what about the most powerful kind of evidence and eye witness joshua ryan. Who now thanks to all these loon protestors gets to go to sleep at night knowing that the person who killed his family and nearly killed him is going to live. You all call that justice I think not.

Guilt or innocence of Cooper aside, if it were my family I hope I would not want "justice" done, if justice is construed as senseless killing. I'm sure I would be devastated, but I hope my firm belief that death is no solution and the death penalty achieves nothing would not be shaken. And I hope I would not find myself wanting to "take justice into my own hands," as tough guys like to say.

Yes, here is a summary of the "powerful eye witness evidence": The only surviving victim, Josh Ryen, told police that his family and friend were murdered by three White or Mexican assailants. Hospital staff testified that right after Josh Ryen was brought in, he communicated that there were three assailants who had his skin color. Josh Ryen is white. Notes taken by Josh’s psychiatrist reveal that he stated, ‘Three Mexicans chased us around the house.’ Mr. Cooper is African-American. When Josh saw a picture of Mr. Cooper on television during the manhunt for the murders, Josh said, ‘That was not the person that did it.’ At trial, the prosecution downplayed Josh’s statements by saying, ‘he was only eight years old, had suffered incredible shock, and thus, his statement was not credible. (cite)

Josh Ryen now has a different point of view, and no one can blame him. But at the time of the murders, he gave no information whatsoever implicating Kevin Cooper.

By the way, I read somewhere that Josh Ryen may have lived with a deputy or prosecutor following the murders. (If true, this would explain much about his subsequent failure to remember three assailants.) If anyone has the facts either way about this, please let us know. Thanks.

When I arrived outside the death chamber waiting room door, it was opened, and I was told to go inside, which I did. I was then told to place my back on the wall while being surrounded by a new squad of officers. These were the officers of the execution squad. There were about eight of them. The leader of the squad got real close to me and asked me if there was going to be any trouble when they took the handcuffs off of me? I looked him in his eyes and told him "no," and he removed the handcuffs.

If my family had been slaughtered like the family Cooper slaughtered I'd want him dead, too, and I doubt if I'd have any trouble making him dead myself. Still, though, here goes another guy from one class of Americans who get the death penalty at a rate far greater than persons from the wealthier, paler classes. There's a remote possibility that Cooper didn't do it, that the cops framed him, but it's so remote as to be non-existent. But if there's any doubt whatsoever, the doomed should not get the midnight needle.

We live in a society that abhors murder and justifies war. The death of one person is a crime, the deaths of thousands a necessity. So who is fit to decide who lives and who dies? A jury of people who have no idea what goes on in a death chamber? A judge or judges picking through pages of words for a flawed legality? Crowds that shout either for blood or for redemption? Editorial writers? Me? You?

Dean: It's freedom of speech, but not on my dime. xowie, myself and others have put time and money into making this site run. If you want to continue to discuss Kevin cooper I recommend starting your own blog - here or here.

It's definitely not freedom of speech to flood someone else's comment board. Besides being childish and rude, it equates to tresspassing, harassment and vandalism.

This is a private website. I do not intend to be interrogated by or forced into a debate with our visitors. Save your vulgar Socratic dialogue for another forum, junior.

FOR ALL WHO THINK KEVIN COOPER IS INNOCENT READ ON........

According to testimony by Kevin Coopers own mother and aunt. Kevin was adopted and was a problem child from the age of 7. He was in and out of the juvenile system. As he got older he had been arrested for several crimes and escaped 11 times. ( sounds like an innocent guy to me )

In June of 1983 Kevin Cooper escaped from the Chino institute for men where they were holding him under another name, David Trautman. Not until he escaped did they realize who they had. The prison is about 2 miles away from the Ryens home where the murders took place. In 1983 Chino Hills was only a horse town. The Ryens were Arabian Horse Ranchers along with the little community that they lived in. The Ryen home sits way up on a hill and can be seen from far away including from the prison. To get to this home one has go up a dirt road OR walk through the neighboring ranches. During the day this home can be seen at the top of the hill but at night it is not visible from the road. There were no street lights. Even today with a church and a high school across the street the house cannot be seen at night. We never locked our doors at night there was no need we felt safe. Kevin Cooper has admitted himself that he hid out in the house right next door to the Ryens which had care takers living there until the day prior to the murders.The care taker was asked to come in and look at the house to see if anything had been missing. When she saw the leather sheath on the floor she said the hatchet that sits at the fireplace was missing because that sheath was the cover for it. 2 knives were also missing plus the ice pick. The phone and electricity were still on in that house. Kevin Cooper admits to that He used the phone 4 times to contact people that testified at his trial 1 being his girlfriend. She said he asked her to get him out of there and she said she didn't want any involvement his other phone calls were to friends asking for the same thing " HELP ME ESCAPE " they all said NO.

This last call was at 8:00 pm The Ryens returned home from a BBQ down the road about 9:00 pm

Kevin saw their car and knew this was his chance.

He waited for them to go to sleep and then he attacked them in cold blood. He took out Doug Ryen with a blow with the hatchet to his head. Doug tried to stop him with his hand but the hatchet chopped off his fingers. Peggy Ryen screamed and she was also silenced.The rest of the victims were children ( a piece of cake for Kevin at this point ) He took out Jessica then Christopher then attempted to silence Josh. Christopher Hughes ( the visiting neighbor child was struck in the face by the hatchet leaving a gapping wound in his face that was from his eyebrow all the way down his nose. As for the hair in Jessica's hand... there is no CLUMP it consists of maybe 5 hairs covered in blood. The police believe that when she was struck in the head with the hatchet her first reaction was to grab her head hence picking up her own hair that was chopped by the blow to her head with the hatchet. Doug Ryen was still slumped over the bed meaning he was never able to fight off the blows he was getting. Peggy was found next to the bed. With the adults out of the way it didn't take much to finish the rest. That is how 1 man commits these crimes. Afterwards Kevin went back to this neighbor house to clean up. He left a bloody footprint in that house ( NOT A SHOE PRINT )Barefoot print. He took a shower and in that shower they found the Ryens hair flesh and blood in that shower along with a bloody FOOTPRINT on a ledge in the shower that belongs to Cooper. Now tell me he isn't guilty

Many people think he is guilty. However, it's really not up to any of us to decide that. The more important question is whether Kevin Cooper had a fair trial. There is good reason to think that he did not. Without a fair trial, the death penalty cannot apply - otherwise it is a lynching sanctioned by the State.

Due to the Court's ruling Cooper's attorneys can now have the blond hairs tested and the t-shirt checked for EDTA. The results may help convince the District Court that reasonable doubt would have existed had there not been law enforcement and prosecutorial misconduct.

xowie: I admit it., You are right. Kevin Cooper did not have a fair trial. And I have been an obnoxious idiot for flooding your message board with my insipid comments and making cowardly anonymous remarks. I truly am a wanker with poor social skills and deficient impulse control. DeanMcCoppin@hotmail.com

Patterns. Look for patterns in the style of the murders. There were murders in Los Angeles County with the same style, during the 70's and 80's. Similar slaughters. How about some murder scene/murder crew profiling?
Keys. The keys to the car were in the ignition.
One drop of blood from the rampaging killers at the scene. One drop.
No hair from the killers at the scene.
Multiple weapons. How long did the slaughter take? Do the math.
The Ryan and The Ryen family lived in the same vicinity. Wrong family killed?
Joshua CHANGED his story, YEARS later. The nurse at his bedside when he was 7 years old, said that Joshua said it is not Cooper.
Cigarette. The cigarette grew in length while in evidence locker.
Tee shirt evidence thrown out. DNA compromised.
Cooper may have come into the scene AFTER the slaughter was over, to steal food, because he was hiding next door?
This seems like an organized hit on the wrong family. Not a one man carnage.